EP 61: Email Marketing for Photographers with Mrs. Vondy: The Email Queen

00:00:00 [Shannon Vondy]
I always thought you had to like, when I first started and, like, had no idea what I was doing with email, I thought you had to have all this, like, crazy stuff.
00:00:05 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:00:05 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you have to have a freebie and a welcome sequence and all this thing.

00:00:09 [Alison]
No.
00:00:10 [Alison]
You don’t need any of that.
00:00:12 [Alison]
Hey, I’m Allison, family photographer, military spouse, and business mentor for photographers.

00:00:18 [Melissa]
And I’m Melissa, also a military spouse, lifestyle new work, and SEO expert for photographers.
00:00:23 [Melissa]
Between the two of us, we have a combined twenty seven years in photography and have lived through nine business relocations.

00:00:29 [Alison]
We’ve coached each other through all these challenges privately on Marco Polo, and now we’re bringing our polos public.
00:00:34 [Alison]
On this podcast, we’ll give you actionable steps to help you keep it moving.

00:00:41 [Melissa]
Welcome back, guys.
00:00:42 [Melissa]
Today, we’re diving into a topic that many of you have been asking about, and that is email marketing for photographers.
00:00:47 [Melissa]
If you’ve ever felt overwhelmed at the thought of starting an email list or, you know, you’ve got an email, like, you don’t know what to do with them, I think this episode is gonna be a favorite.
00:00:56 [Melissa]
I have a feeling we’re gonna get a lot of listen.
00:00:57 [Melissa]
We are joined today by Shannon, aka missus Vondy, aka the email queen, who specializes in helping photographers connect with clients through effective email marketing.

00:01:07 [Melissa]
So I found Shannon, like, a year and a half ago for, her email club.
00:01:11 [Melissa]
And I remember I, like, saw the sales page, but it wasn’t open.
00:01:14 [Melissa]
And I, like, saved it and, like, bookmarked it and was like, I wanna know when it opens.
00:01:19 [Melissa]
And then I joined, and I’ve been a member for, like, over a year and a half now, I think, almost.
00:01:23 [Melissa]
So welcome to the show, Shannon.

00:01:25 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:01:25 [Melissa]
Welcome.
00:01:26 [Melissa]
Thanks for being here.

00:01:27 [Alison]
Thanks for

00:01:27 [Shannon Vondy]
having me.
00:01:28 [Shannon Vondy]
I’m so excited to be here.

00:01:29 [Melissa]
Yes.
00:01:30 [Melissa]
I mean, when Allison and I were talking about like, okay, hey, email marketing is like a big thing.
00:01:34 [Melissa]
I was like, oh, I know who we should talk to.
00:01:35 [Melissa]
And so I reached out to Shannon.
00:01:36 [Melissa]
I was like Yeah.

00:01:37 [Alison]
And any photographer who has done many sessions has an email list.
00:01:41 [Alison]
Any photographer who’s done more than one client session has an email list.

00:01:45 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:01:46 [Melissa]
And actually one thing to point out too for Shannon is she is a photographer.
00:01:49 [Melissa]
So she really understands it from a photographer perspective, guys.

00:01:53 [Alison]
How did you go from photography to email queen?

00:01:55 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s a great question.
00:01:56 [Shannon Vondy]
So the year was 2020 as, many of us probably have strong

00:02:00 [Alison]
waist cones

00:02:01 [Shannon Vondy]
that year.
00:02:01 [Shannon Vondy]
And I my husband and I ran a full time wedding photography business for ten years.
00:02:06 [Shannon Vondy]
Up to that point, we were on track to have our best year ever.
00:02:09 [Shannon Vondy]
And, of course, we all know what happened.
00:02:11 [Shannon Vondy]
And in mere months bottom fell out.

00:02:13 [Shannon Vondy]
Literally.
00:02:14 [Shannon Vondy]
In mere months, we almost lost our entire business.
00:02:17 [Shannon Vondy]
So I was like, this is crazy.
00:02:19 [Shannon Vondy]
But I started helping a friend of mine.
00:02:21 [Shannon Vondy]
I’d I’d tried email before.

00:02:23 [Shannon Vondy]
Before this whole thing.
00:02:23 [Shannon Vondy]
I tried it before.
00:02:24 [Shannon Vondy]
I really didn’t see anything with it, so I just didn’t think it was work.
00:02:26 [Shannon Vondy]
I think I actually thought it didn’t work for photographers, like, embarrassingly.
00:02:29 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s not what I thought.

00:02:31 [Shannon Vondy]
I love that honesty.
00:02:32 [Shannon Vondy]
I mean, I took a course and everything, and I still like, from a a good well known entrepreneur, and I was like,

00:02:38 [Melissa]
this isn’t working for me.
00:02:39 [Melissa]
Course.

00:02:39 [Alison]
I think you said yes.
00:02:41 [Alison]
And thank you.
00:02:41 [Alison]
People can guess.

00:02:42 [Shannon Vondy]
You can DM me.
00:02:42 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ll tell you who to

00:02:43 [Melissa]
yeah.

00:02:43 [Alison]
I was like, this just doesn’t work.
00:02:45 [Alison]
So I started helping a friend of mine who did email, and I realized I’m like, you know what?
00:02:48 [Alison]
I don’t I don’t know if I’ve been doing this right.

00:02:51 [Shannon Vondy]
And so I thought, you know what?
00:02:52 [Shannon Vondy]
I have nothing to lose.
00:02:53 [Shannon Vondy]
Let me just try it again.
00:02:54 [Shannon Vondy]
So I put, you know, I got all my emails.
00:02:56 [Shannon Vondy]
I I

00:02:56 [Alison]
sent an email and I made 2,600.

00:02:58 [Shannon Vondy]
What?
00:02:59 [Shannon Vondy]
I was like, oh, this is what everyone’s been saying when they say you need an email list and you need to be emailing.
00:03:04 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, I thought, oh my gosh.
00:03:06 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ve just been doing it wrong.
00:03:07 [Shannon Vondy]
And do other business owner about this?

00:03:09 [Shannon Vondy]
How come no one’s teaching them this?
00:03:12 [Shannon Vondy]
And I had this light bulb moment of, like, I should teach them this.
00:03:16 [Shannon Vondy]
I should share an account to do this.

00:03:17 [Alison]
Can I ask what you were selling?

00:03:19 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:03:19 [Shannon Vondy]
I just did a print sale.

00:03:20 [Alison]
I literally just ran a print sale.

00:03:21 [Shannon Vondy]
Oh my gosh.
00:03:23 [Shannon Vondy]
Via email.
00:03:23 [Shannon Vondy]
I don’t sell in person.
00:03:25 [Shannon Vondy]
I and what’s crazy is I went on that year.
00:03:27 [Shannon Vondy]
I thought, okay.

00:03:28 [Shannon Vondy]
This is just a fluke.
00:03:29 [Shannon Vondy]
So I went on that year.
00:03:30 [Shannon Vondy]
I sent another batch of emails a few months later, and I made another, like, $1,300.
00:03:34 [Shannon Vondy]
And I set up a little funnel in my back end too, and I made I wound up making almost $13,000 my first, like, using email.

00:03:41 [Alison]
And I was like, oh my god.
00:03:42 [Alison]
I slept

00:03:42 [Shannon Vondy]
on so much money for so long in my business.
00:03:46 [Shannon Vondy]
I worked harder than I needed to.
00:03:47 [Shannon Vondy]
I literally could have been making $10,000 minimum a year just from email had I taken the time to figure out how to use it.
00:03:55 [Shannon Vondy]
And, I mean, obviously, Melissa, you know, we took a course that taught us nothing.
00:03:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.

00:03:59 [Shannon Vondy]
So that was, obviously set us back a little bit.
00:04:02 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s not entirely,

00:04:04 [Alison]
be in your DMs later.
00:04:05 [Alison]
It’s literally easiest thing.
00:04:07 [Alison]
That’s what’s so crazy.
00:04:08 [Alison]
It’s not

00:04:08 [Shannon Vondy]
as hard as we all think it is.
00:04:10 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:04:10 [Shannon Vondy]
And anything I say today, we did not use email for ten years.
00:04:13 [Shannon Vondy]
So, like, know that I am also in your shoes.
00:04:16 [Shannon Vondy]
So I’m not knocking you.

00:04:17 [Shannon Vondy]
I’m saying I did it too.

00:04:19 [Alison]
Yeah.
00:04:19 [Alison]
And I think that’s the value of having you on is, like, I Melissa and I are saying the same things.
00:04:23 [Alison]
Like, we’ve been saying this over and over again, but to have somebody who’s, like, doing this to a different level and then for and with other people too is just, like, just trying to, like, beat the hammer.

00:04:32 [Melissa]
You know?
00:04:32 [Melissa]
Like Having an email list of past clients, like, before we moved, and I was like, alright.
00:04:37 [Melissa]
I need to book my calendar and make sure I’ve got plenty of sessions.
00:04:40 [Melissa]
You know, I’m just sending out a few emails saying, hey.
00:04:43 [Melissa]
Let’s do this.
00:04:43 [Melissa]
And, you know, $5,000 in sessions booked out of it.
00:04:46 [Melissa]
That was just existing clients.

00:04:48 [Shannon Vondy]
Yes.
00:04:48 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s crazy.
00:04:49 [Shannon Vondy]
And I love that.
00:04:49 [Shannon Vondy]
But, like, also a quick correction.
00:04:50 [Shannon Vondy]
I have a mastermind with Melissa and her mastermind.
00:04:52 [Shannon Vondy]
And she told me, honestly, she sent out two emails, and she booked fifty.

00:04:55 [Melissa]
I for got.

00:04:57 [Shannon Vondy]
Before that.

00:04:57 [Melissa]
Forgot.
00:04:58 [Melissa]
Yeah.

00:04:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Yes.
00:04:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Two emails.

00:05:00 [Melissa]
Yes.
00:05:00 [Melissa]
I sent, like, an initial, like, let’s get going.
00:05:02 [Melissa]
And then, like, a week later, I sent a second one that was like, hey.
00:05:05 [Melissa]
We’ve got a few spot and, like, fifty thousand.
00:05:07 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:05:08 [Melissa]
Two emails.

00:05:08 [Shannon Vondy]
I’m sure people are always like, oh, two emails, even more.

00:05:11 [Alison]
Then what did you write in the emails?
00:05:13 [Alison]
Like, what was the content?

00:05:14 [Melissa]
Like, literally, hey.
00:05:15 [Melissa]
We’re getting ready to move.
00:05:17 [Melissa]
Like, if you wanna be in a session because you know we’re moving, you know, sign up here.
00:05:22 [Melissa]
And then, like, two weeks later, it was I think it was more than a week later, actually.
00:05:26 [Melissa]
It was, like, almost two weeks later.
00:05:27 [Melissa]
I was like, we’ve had a couple things that have opened up.
00:05:29 [Melissa]
So, like, the spots are still there.
00:05:30 [Melissa]
And I would say, like, seven people, maybe eight people, like, immediately booked after the first email.
00:05:36 [Melissa]
And then I think the second email got, like, another three or four.
00:05:39 [Melissa]
I was like, look at me, guys.

00:05:40 [Shannon Vondy]
Like No.
00:05:41 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s crazy.

00:05:41 [Melissa]
When I tell her, like, no, people wanna work with you all the time, she’s like, they don’t wanna work with me though.
00:05:47 [Melissa]
No.
00:05:48 [Melissa]
No.
00:05:48 [Melissa]
I get it.
00:05:49 [Melissa]
It’s that whole imposter syndrome.

00:05:50 [Alison]
Yeah.
00:05:51 [Alison]
And I mean, but they did want.

00:05:52 [Shannon Vondy]
They did want the truth.
00:05:53 [Shannon Vondy]
I like, I when when you told me that, I was like, are you okay?
00:05:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you should really take care of yourself.
00:05:58 [Shannon Vondy]
So if you guys listening right now are like, this can’t be me, like, I’m telling you.
00:06:01 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ve heard this from so many photographers, and I literally talked to a photographer yesterday who was like, I’ve been thinking about moving to doing done.
00:06:08 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s a huge income booster, guys.
00:06:09 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, it is.
00:06:10 [Shannon Vondy]
And not only that, but, like, it’s it puts you in your client’s mind.
00:06:14 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:06:14 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, they’re so busy too, and you’re popping in their inbox.
00:06:17 [Shannon Vondy]
And they may not even buy that moment, but you’ve planted a little seed.
00:06:19 [Shannon Vondy]
And maybe they come back in two weeks or two months and they, you know, finally have that thing that they’re like, oh, I should buy.

00:06:25 [Shannon Vondy]
And they come back and they they book with you.
00:06:27 [Shannon Vondy]
And that that’s that’s that’s the emails in a nutshell, really.
00:06:30 [Shannon Vondy]
Just staying in front of people and planting little seeds.

00:06:32 [Alison]
And I get it too.
00:06:33 [Alison]
Like, social media is the dopamine hit.
00:06:34 [Alison]
Oh, like, I posted a photo.
00:06:36 [Alison]
And immediately, I get likes or comments or whatever.
00:06:39 [Alison]
And meanwhile, in my back end, I have all these features and all these things and and and analytics that I’m paying for that I’m not utilizing because it’s not that instant dopamine hit.

00:06:49 [Alison]
And that’s the the biggest hurdle and the hardest thing, is just, like, doing something that’s a back end thing that’s working for me all the time, even when even when they don’t book that day.
00:06:58 [Alison]
Even when I post an Instagram story or a post, I get feedback immediately.
00:07:03 [Alison]
But email, that’s where the money is.
00:07:04 [Alison]
That’s the back end business thing.

00:07:06 [Shannon Vondy]
Well and it’s funny because I think people honestly don’t know.
00:07:09 [Shannon Vondy]
I didn’t.
00:07:09 [Shannon Vondy]
I don’t know that anyone knows this until you get into email, but you can track your opens.
00:07:14 [Shannon Vondy]
You can track what they’re clicking on.
00:07:15 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you actually can get that dopamine hit.

00:07:18 [Shannon Vondy]
You know?
00:07:18 [Shannon Vondy]
And I think I think it’s amazing when you set things up on your back end too because it’s like even more powerful.
00:07:24 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you can see someone sign up for your list, and then they get your welcome email that you wrote one time, and they click on that thing in your welcome email, and they go to the you know, like, it it’s is so cool to see how that plays out.

00:07:36 [Alison]
Man, you are you are totally inspiring me today, but I do have a concern, though, coming from me.

00:07:41 [Alison]
Right?
00:07:42 [Alison]
So I had an email list for a year, year and a half.
00:07:44 [Alison]
And then I did nothing with it.
00:07:46 [Alison]
So now to start, I feel like people signed up and they’re like, oh, yeah.
00:07:50 [Alison]
Allison.
00:07:50 [Alison]
Like, I signed up, like, two years ago.
00:07:52 [Alison]
And then nothing.
00:07:53 [Alison]
And to me, that feels like a dis integrity thing.
00:07:56 [Alison]
Like, what do I do about that?

00:07:58 [Shannon Vondy]
So I address this all the time.
00:07:59 [Shannon Vondy]
And I think the fear behind emailing your list is bigger than the reality of what will happen when you do.
00:08:05 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:08:06 [Shannon Vondy]
So one, people do know that.
00:08:08 [Shannon Vondy]
People also forget that they sign up for things.
00:08:10 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:08:10 [Shannon Vondy]
So I’m not saying that you shouldn’t address it, but also they might not know.

00:08:14 [Shannon Vondy]
So if you wanna address it, you definitely could.
00:08:15 [Shannon Vondy]
You could say something like, hey.
00:08:16 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ve been away for a minute because I’ve been doing this.
00:08:18 [Shannon Vondy]
And I’m doing this thing that’s super exciting or whatever, and I just wanted to reconnect and show and talk about whatever.
00:08:23 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:08:23 [Shannon Vondy]
But, like, you could be honest.
00:08:25 [Shannon Vondy]
If you need to say, like, hey, you know, business wise, this wasn’t necessarily on the top of my radar.

00:08:29 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, I think you could be honest, but I also don’t necessarily know if you have to be.
00:08:33 [Shannon Vondy]
You could also just be like, hey, everybody.
00:08:35 [Shannon Vondy]
You know, welcome back.
00:08:36 [Shannon Vondy]
If you’ve been here with me, like, you know what I do.
00:08:38 [Shannon Vondy]
And if you’re new, this is what I do.
00:08:40 [Shannon Vondy]
And you you could just you could just get started.

00:08:42 [Shannon Vondy]
The other component to that is when we don’t email for a long period of time, people do forget that they’re on our list.
00:08:47 [Shannon Vondy]
So your spam rate will be a little bit higher than normal.
00:08:50 [Shannon Vondy]
Correct.
00:08:51 [Shannon Vondy]
So your unsubscribe rate may be higher than it was if you had consistently emailed, but that’s okay.
00:08:57 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you don’t need every person on your list.

00:08:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you don’t need all that.
00:08:59 [Shannon Vondy]
You need the people who wanna hear from you and who wanna be on your list and who wanna book you and who resonate with you and what you’re doing and and all that.
00:09:07 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:09:07 [Shannon Vondy]
And so getting the unsubscribes, that that’s not a bad thing.
00:09:10 [Shannon Vondy]
And I always tell people that because when you’re new to email and you get a few, you’re like, oh my god.

00:09:13 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, I’m doing something wrong.
00:09:15 [Shannon Vondy]
I’m like, no, trust me.
00:09:16 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you wanna have a healthy email list.
00:09:18 [Shannon Vondy]
You should have some of people leaving.
00:09:20 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s a it’s a natural thing.
00:09:21 [Shannon Vondy]
It doesn’t have to be something that means you’re doing something wrong.

00:09:23 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s just part of of it.
00:09:24 [Shannon Vondy]
So I would say, yeah, you could address it.
00:09:26 [Shannon Vondy]
You don’t have to.
00:09:28 [Shannon Vondy]
And know that if you have higher unsubscribes when you do, that’s totally normal when you when you’re doing it for the first time after a long break or for the first time.

00:09:37 [Alison]
That’s really good.

00:09:38 [Melissa]
I will say too, Shannon.
00:09:40 [Melissa]
Just to back you up, like, when I started after, like, I wasn’t really consistent with my email list for a while, and then, like, the last year and a half or so, I’ve been way more consistent.
00:09:48 [Melissa]
And I had, like, 1,000 people before.
00:09:49 [Melissa]
And then, like, I sent, like, a couple emails, and, like, I think I went down to, like, 600 people.
00:09:54 [Melissa]
And I was like, well, this is sad.
00:09:56 [Melissa]
But the reality is I’ve now grown it back to, like, 1,200, but it’s people who are actually interested because when I email people now, like, my open rates are, like, in the thirties and sometimes in the forties, like so much better than it was when I had, like, a thousand people.

00:10:10 [Shannon Vondy]
Mhmm.

00:10:11 [Melissa]
So, like, I’ll tell you all that just to say, like, that’s exactly what it was.
00:10:14 [Melissa]
Like, I needed to get rid of people who weren’t, like, interested because they were actually hurting me.
00:10:18 [Melissa]
Like, they weren’t helping.
00:10:20 [Melissa]
They weren’t opening the emails.

00:10:21 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:10:21 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re exactly right.
00:10:22 [Shannon Vondy]
That it can actually have be detrimental to your list to have a bunch of non engagement.
00:10:27 [Shannon Vondy]
So the bigger number doesn’t necessarily mean a better list.

00:10:30 [Shannon Vondy]
Like so Yeah.
00:10:31 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.
00:10:32 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re right.
00:10:33 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you you know, that’s that’s exactly what needs to happen, and that’s good.
00:10:36 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s not bad.
00:10:36 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s so it’s so funny how we’ve been trained to, like, think more numbers equals better.

00:10:41 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:10:41 [Shannon Vondy]
But in this case, like, that’s not the case.
00:10:42 [Shannon Vondy]
You don’t need, like, eighty thousand people.
00:10:44 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you don’t need it.

00:10:45 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:10:46 [Melissa]
I think if if you’re a photographer too, like, you don’t necessarily need to have, like, a big email list.
00:10:50 [Melissa]
Like, yeah, it’s good if you do.
00:10:51 [Melissa]
But, like, it’s better to have people who actually want to interact with you and hear from you and, you know, wanna book you, especially if you’re a service.
00:10:59 [Melissa]
Provider, you don’t necessarily need, like, 5,000 people.
00:11:01 [Melissa]
You probably can’t service 5,000 people.

00:11:03 [Shannon Vondy]
Right.

00:11:04 [Alison]
Does this work for photographers who are not product based?
00:11:07 [Alison]
Right?
00:11:07 [Alison]
Because I know you said, like, print sale and things like that.
00:11:09 [Alison]
But what if your session fee is your money maker and you’re, like, you’re living off that session fee?
00:11:15 [Alison]
Does it work for those types too?

00:11:17 [Shannon Vondy]
Absolutely.
00:11:18 [Shannon Vondy]
So we actually have several photographers, portrait and family and, like, people who are just booking the session.
00:11:22 [Shannon Vondy]
So it’s a little bit more complicated, not complicated, but it’s different when it’s a product sale, obviously, versus a service booking.

00:11:29 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:11:29 [Shannon Vondy]
So in your case, like, you you don’t really have, unless you do have prints or albums or whatever, you don’t really have something that can I can just buy something super quick?
00:11:37 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:11:37 [Shannon Vondy]
So there’s a little bit more playing the long game, but it still works.

00:11:40 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s just like you I would say you really, really need to to nurture your list.
00:11:44 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:11:44 [Shannon Vondy]
So that means showing up in their inbox consistently, proving to them that you’re the right person, the expert in your area, and that they should book with you.
00:11:51 [Shannon Vondy]
And then, obviously, when it’s time, you’re pitching your service.

00:11:54 [Shannon Vondy]
So it’s a little bit more complicated, but it I I think it works even better for photographers, honestly, or sorry, photographers who are service based.
00:12:03 [Shannon Vondy]
Not like, I wasn’t calling you not a photographer, but, like, that are not product based.
00:12:06 [Shannon Vondy]
I think it works even better for them because you’re creating this relationship.

00:12:10 [Shannon Vondy]
And, yeah, someone can buy your product and literally never meet you.
00:12:14 [Shannon Vondy]
So they they can so they have to trust you with their money, but they don’t they don’t have to, like, trust you.
00:12:18 [Shannon Vondy]
You know what I mean?

00:12:19 [Melissa]
I feel like session fees even more so because you need someone to trust you more because it’s an experience versus buying a tangible product.

00:12:26 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.

00:12:26 [Melissa]
So they need to know who you are and, you know, what your personality is, so that when they go into that session, like, they already kind of know you, even though they’ve never, like, met you.

00:12:36 [Shannon Vondy]
Right.
00:12:36 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.
00:12:36 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s so good when you have a relationship with your client via email, and then you finally meet them in person and they’re like, oh, I feel like I know you.
00:12:42 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, that’s the best feeling.

00:12:43 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:12:44 [Shannon Vondy]
And and you’re like, you’re halfway there now.
00:12:45 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you’re

00:12:46 [Alison]
having this trust in you.
00:12:47 [Alison]
And if you tell them, hey.
00:12:48 [Alison]
Jump on one foot.
00:12:49 [Alison]
They’re like, oh, okay.
00:12:49 [Alison]
Yeah.
00:12:50 [Alison]
Sure.

00:12:50 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you know what I’m saying?
00:12:51 [Shannon Vondy]
So or Yeah.
00:12:52 [Shannon Vondy]
They’re not going to argue with you about the pose or, like, all that.
00:12:54 [Shannon Vondy]
So no.
00:12:55 [Shannon Vondy]
It still really, really works well.
00:12:56 [Shannon Vondy]
I think there’s just a difference in strategy.

00:12:58 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:12:58 [Shannon Vondy]
So emails selling a product or something a product versus emails selling a service look a little bit different, but it still definitely can work.

00:13:06 [Alison]
And there’s not a freebie necessary, or is this just something that I set up, and then I put them on my on my email list just from initial, like, me working with them and getting their email?

00:13:17 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:13:18 [Shannon Vondy]
So I always thought you had to like, when I first started and, like, had no idea what I was doing with email, I thought you had to have all this, like, crazy stuff.
00:13:24 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:13:24 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you have to have a freebie and a welcome sequence and all this thing.

00:13:26 [Alison]
No.
00:13:27 [Alison]
You don’t need any of that.
00:13:28 [Alison]
All you need is a place to collect your emails.
00:13:30 [Alison]
Right?
00:13:31 [Alison]
So if someone’s, you know, contacting you to for a photography session, like, boom.

00:13:35 [Alison]
That’s your email.
00:13:36 [Alison]
You put them in your CRM.
00:13:37 [Alison]
Right?
00:13:37 [Alison]
Like, that’s your list, guys.
00:13:38 [Alison]
That’s your email list.
00:13:39 [Alison]
Yeah.

00:13:39 [Alison]
So that’s a list.
00:13:40 [Alison]
It doesn’t matter if it’s in your CRM or in an email provider.
00:13:43 [Alison]
Like, they’re still you still have it.
00:13:45 [Alison]
So all you do is just you email them.

00:13:47 [Shannon Vondy]
However you’re emailing right now, whether you put them in an email list like I use Kit or you use Mailchimp or Constant Contact or FlowDesk or any of that.
00:13:55 [Shannon Vondy]
Or you’re literally using your Gmail.
00:13:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you put all your clients, you know, in the to your thing and you send them.
00:13:59 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s fine.

00:14:00 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you just need to send.
00:14:01 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s the most important thing.
00:14:02 [Shannon Vondy]
It really is.
00:14:03 [Shannon Vondy]
And you don’t have to have a fancy welcome sequence and a freebie and all that.

00:14:06 [Shannon Vondy]
You can just literally send out an email and ask people to book.
00:14:09 [Shannon Vondy]
You you you already have their email in your CRM, so you don’t even need a landing page.
00:14:13 [Shannon Vondy]
You don’t need a lead magnet.
00:14:14 [Shannon Vondy]
You have nothing.
00:14:15 [Shannon Vondy]
And and just because you decide you’re gonna start emailing tomorrow, that doesn’t mean you now need a landing page.

00:14:20 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, all that stuff will come later if you want it.
00:14:22 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you don’t have to have it, obviously, but it will come later if you want it.
00:14:25 [Shannon Vondy]
And you can add it to your business, you know, whenever you’re ready to do that.
00:14:28 [Shannon Vondy]
But just start emailing.
00:14:29 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s the most important thing.

00:14:31 [Melissa]
Okay.
00:14:31 [Melissa]
So now I wanna dive into the question everyone’s probably thinking, which is, like, how often should I email?

00:14:36 [Shannon Vondy]
Mhmm.

00:14:36 [Melissa]
Like, if I have, like, in my CRM, I’ve got, like, you know, maybe a hundred emails or something like that.
00:14:40 [Melissa]
Like, how often should I be emailing those emails?
00:14:42 [Melissa]
Like, am I sending once a week?
00:14:44 [Melissa]
Once a month?
00:14:44 [Melissa]
Or maybe it’s more so.

00:14:46 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:14:47 [Shannon Vondy]
So if I could get photographers to do at least once a month, oh my gosh, I’d be so happy.

00:14:52 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:14:52 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, that would be so good, and that’s doable for most people.
00:14:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Now if you could do more weekly, biweekly, like, that’s even better.
00:15:00 [Shannon Vondy]
But minimum, I would say you should be emailing your list.

00:15:03 [Shannon Vondy]
And here’s why.
00:15:03 [Shannon Vondy]
The reason I say once a month is because I don’t want you to, let’s say, send in January and then not send again till March.
00:15:10 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you you really need that frequency.
00:15:12 [Shannon Vondy]
So if you’re gonna commit to it, you need to commit to it.

00:15:15 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s not like you send a random email and you’re good for the quarter.
00:15:18 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:15:18 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you really do have to show up, if that makes sense.
00:15:21 [Shannon Vondy]
So minimum, I say once a month.

00:15:23 [Shannon Vondy]
And, again, I think that’s the most doable for people to see success with it because you’re also like, once a month, you’ll have a lot to say, which can make it easier for you to send.
00:15:31 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, if you’re like, oh, if you start emailing weekly, you’re like, oh my god.
00:15:35 [Shannon Vondy]
I have to, you know, write something this week again.
00:15:37 [Shannon Vondy]
And then you’re thinking about it all the time.

00:15:38 [Shannon Vondy]
But once a month, you have a you have a lot to say by now.
00:15:41 [Shannon Vondy]
So that’s the ideal, frequency.
00:15:43 [Shannon Vondy]
But I know that people are some people like, once a month is a lot.

00:15:46 [Shannon Vondy]
So I would say the absolute minimum you could do and still see success is probably quarterly.
00:15:51 [Shannon Vondy]
So, you know, once every three months, but I honestly don’t even think that’s enough.
00:15:56 [Shannon Vondy]
I think that at that point, you’re basically, like, emailing people from, you know, my client who sent emails in the fall, and that’s it, basically.

00:16:03 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:16:03 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s the max.
00:16:04 [Shannon Vondy]
So I really once a month is is what I recommend, but you get more touchpoints if you do biweekly or or once a week.

00:16:13 [Alison]
And what’s a touch point?

00:16:14 [Shannon Vondy]
So, like, every time you’re in their inbox, that’s that’s a touch point.
00:16:17 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:16:17 [Shannon Vondy]
So let’s say someone just saw you in a Facebook group and then they’re like, oh, there’s Melissa’s email.
00:16:22 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, I should reach out to her.
00:16:23 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, that’s yeah.

00:16:24 [Shannon Vondy]
So it’s it’s bringing you top of mind.
00:16:25 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s reminding them that you exist.
00:16:28 [Shannon Vondy]
Because think about how how many people you have forgotten about.
00:16:30 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:16:31 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, it’s not your fault.

00:16:32 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s life.
00:16:33 [Shannon Vondy]
You have a lot going on.
00:16:33 [Shannon Vondy]
So having those people, like, send you an email and you’re, like, you’re checking your email regularly, is really helpful.

00:16:39 [Shannon Vondy]
So you’re getting that touch point.

00:16:41 [Alison]
You’re still Yeah.

00:16:42 [Melissa]
That’s actually very good.
00:16:43 [Melissa]
I like that.

00:16:44 [Shannon Vondy]
So I would say, yeah, once a month, minimum.
00:16:46 [Shannon Vondy]
But, again, you get better results if you’re emailing more.
00:16:49 [Shannon Vondy]
Because and and here’s the thing.
00:16:51 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ve I’ve told people this on Instagram.
00:16:53 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ve heard this question a lot.

00:16:54 [Shannon Vondy]
People always say, like, isn’t that too much?
00:16:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Won’t people get annoyed?
00:16:57 [Shannon Vondy]
And the thing is, people will unsubscribe if they don’t like it.
00:16:59 [Shannon Vondy]
So if they unsubscribe, that doesn’t mean you did something wrong.

00:17:02 [Shannon Vondy]
It just means it’s not for them.
00:17:03 [Shannon Vondy]
And that’s okay.
00:17:04 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you don’t need everyone to stay on your list.
00:17:06 [Shannon Vondy]
And I know I kinda said that earlier, but when you’re thinking about emailing, like, let’s say you email once a week.

00:17:10 [Shannon Vondy]
Someone might be like, oh my gosh.
00:17:11 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s so much.
00:17:12 [Shannon Vondy]
But they’ll unsubscribe.
00:17:13 [Shannon Vondy]
So then you don’t have to worry about that person anymore.
00:17:15 [Shannon Vondy]
You just focus on the people who are there.

00:17:16 [Shannon Vondy]
And the people who are there don’t mind.
00:17:18 [Shannon Vondy]
So if you’re emailing once a week and they haven’t unsubscribed, they they like hearing from you.
00:17:22 [Shannon Vondy]
So I I would say, you know, like, don’t worry so much about, like, oh, is it gonna be too much for these people?

00:17:28 [Shannon Vondy]
Because those people who really don’t wanna hear from you weekly, they’ll just leave.
00:17:31 [Shannon Vondy]
And that’s okay.

00:17:32 [Melissa]
Mhmm.

00:17:33 [Alison]
So what are you writing when you are sending out these emails?
00:17:36 [Alison]
Like, let’s say you’re doing a once a month and you have nothing to sell.
00:17:40 [Alison]
Right?
00:17:40 [Alison]
So you’re not doing a print sale.
00:17:41 [Alison]
You’ve been shooting a bit, but there’s, you know, nothing like to really sell that’s making a huge impact.

00:17:47 [Alison]
What are you writing about?

00:17:49 [Shannon Vondy]
Anything.
00:17:49 [Shannon Vondy]
So the the thing that’s really great about email, in my opinion, is it’s a sandbox.
00:17:54 [Shannon Vondy]
You can do whatever you want, and it’s really hard to make a mistake.
00:17:57 [Shannon Vondy]
So in your case, like, you can talk about anything.

00:17:59 [Shannon Vondy]
You can share a personal story about something that’s going on in your life, and that alone can be enough.
00:18:04 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:18:04 [Shannon Vondy]
Or you can, like, share a tip with them.
00:18:06 [Shannon Vondy]
So let’s say you’re, I don’t know, you you’re a photographer and you do family sessions.

00:18:10 [Shannon Vondy]
You can talk about how they can prepare for a session.
00:18:12 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:18:12 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s a that’s an email right there.
00:18:14 [Shannon Vondy]
And then you end it with, like, hey.

00:18:15 [Shannon Vondy]
I’m booking sessions for fall, and I’d love to have you.
00:18:18 [Shannon Vondy]
Or right now, I’m doing a May mini session, you know, or whatever you’re doing.
00:18:22 [Shannon Vondy]
So you’re giving value and then you’re selling.
00:18:24 [Shannon Vondy]
And your email list is the best place to do that.

00:18:27 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you can sell to them because they’re your people.
00:18:29 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, they’ve they’ve either, you know, given you their email or they’ve worked with you before.
00:18:34 [Shannon Vondy]
So, like, you have permission to email them.
00:18:36 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s the biggest thing.

00:18:37 [Shannon Vondy]
So you can literally talk about anything you want, and you can end it with a sell or a pitch.
00:18:42 [Shannon Vondy]
And, actually, I recommend doing that with every email.
00:18:45 [Shannon Vondy]
So, like, you should have a call to action in every email you send.
00:18:49 [Shannon Vondy]
If you’re trying to sell something, like if you’re trying to book sessions, every email should have that pitch in it somewhere.

00:18:54 [Shannon Vondy]
It doesn’t have to be, like, your entire email.
00:18:56 [Shannon Vondy]
It could just be a little line at the bottom that says, like, I’m booking right now or, you know, whatever.
00:19:00 [Shannon Vondy]
But you should have that in there every time.

00:19:03 [Alison]
What about if I write a blog?
00:19:05 [Alison]
Right?
00:19:05 [Alison]
And I write the blog and I blog it on my site, can I send an email that then links to the blog post?

00:19:12 [Shannon Vondy]
Absolutely.
00:19:13 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:19:13 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s a great way to send an email.
00:19:14 [Shannon Vondy]
So you’re basically taking a snippet from that blog post and you’re sharing in your email, and then you’re, like, click here to keep reading or whatever.

00:19:21 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:19:21 [Shannon Vondy]
So that can be your value.
00:19:23 [Shannon Vondy]
And it also gets them back to your website, which is great for your SEO, as you guys know.
00:19:27 [Shannon Vondy]
So you you definitely could do that.

00:19:30 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s a great way to do it.

00:19:31 [Alison]
Awesome.

00:19:32 [Melissa]
So one thing, like, I’m curious about, I know, like, you’ve said people will, like, you know, if it’s too much, they can unsubscribe and all that.

00:19:38 [Melissa]
When you’re talking once a week, are they literally, like, on the same day of the week every single week?
00:19:44 [Melissa]
Or is it, like, once it’s, like, a week after you sent the last email?
00:19:47 [Melissa]
Like, what what would that look like for a service based business that is just kinda, like, trying to touch base every week, but you’re not doing sales as much?

00:19:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:19:56 [Shannon Vondy]
So you I personally send my email on the same day every week.
00:19:59 [Shannon Vondy]
I send it every Tuesday.
00:20:01 [Shannon Vondy]
Most people do that.

00:20:02 [Shannon Vondy]
But you do not have to be consistent with that if you’re just starting out or if you need to give yourself grace.
00:20:08 [Shannon Vondy]
So let’s say you wanted to email once a week and you sent an email today on, you know, let’s just say Tuesday.
00:20:13 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:20:13 [Shannon Vondy]
And you wanted to send on Tuesday every single week, but the next Tuesday comes and, you know, your kid’s sick or something.

00:20:19 [Shannon Vondy]
And you’re like, oh, I I can’t do it.
00:20:21 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s okay.
00:20:22 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, just send it on Friday or send it whenever you can.
00:20:24 [Shannon Vondy]
It does not have to be perfect.

00:20:26 [Shannon Vondy]
And again, going back to that fear, like, people are not thinking about, like, oh my god.
00:20:30 [Shannon Vondy]
She sent it on Tuesday last time and then she sent it on Friday this time.
00:20:33 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, no one cares.
00:20:34 [Shannon Vondy]
People are just gonna open it.

00:20:36 [Shannon Vondy]
So, yeah, you could send on the same day or you can just give yourself grace and send it whenever you have the time.
00:20:41 [Shannon Vondy]
Now if you’re, like, if you’re selling, like, that’s a different thing.
00:20:44 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, when you’re launching something or you’re, like, having a sale, you do wanna, like, time it a little bit better because that’s when people are expecting to hear from you.

00:20:52 [Shannon Vondy]
But for just everyday, keep in touch emails, you can send it whenever you can.

00:20:56 [Melissa]
Okay.
00:20:57 [Melissa]
That’s helpful.

00:20:58 [Alison]
What about that?
00:20:59 [Alison]
What you said really resonated with me.
00:21:01 [Alison]
You said, a a launching.
00:21:02 [Alison]
Right?
00:21:02 [Alison]
So if you’ve got something to launch, like, oh, I have mini sessions, right, or I have this other, and then you could send an initial email with the announcement and then a nudge email and then a last call email and see if people are interested.

00:21:14 [Alison]
Or what does that look like?

00:21:16 [Shannon Vondy]
Yes.
00:21:16 [Shannon Vondy]
So I’ll I’ll give you an example of what we do in our business, and this is across the board.
00:21:20 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, any anyone who’s launching can use this strategy.

00:21:23 [Shannon Vondy]
So we have a membership that we open doors four times a year.
00:21:26 [Shannon Vondy]
And when we open doors, I send a lot of emails.
00:21:29 [Shannon Vondy]
So typically, when you’re when you’re selling or launching something, you wanna send more than your, like, your regular content emails that you would normally send.

00:21:36 [Shannon Vondy]
So let’s say you normally send once a month.
00:21:39 [Shannon Vondy]
When you launch or when you have a sale, you might wanna send multiple times a week.
00:21:42 [Shannon Vondy]
So for our membership launch, I send an email, almost every day for seven days.

00:21:48 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:21:48 [Shannon Vondy]
So we’re open for seven days.
00:21:50 [Shannon Vondy]
So I email them, like, every day to, like, let them know we’re open.
00:21:53 [Shannon Vondy]
But I also have specific things that I’m talking about in each email, whether it’s, like, benefits or, you know, showing them around, like, all that fun stuff.

00:22:00 [Shannon Vondy]
But when you have a short sale or a short open, you definitely wanna increase that frequency because they need to know that you’re like, they need to remember it.
00:22:09 [Shannon Vondy]
Otherwise, if you just send one email the first day and then one email the last day, most people are not like, you might lose out on people.
00:22:15 [Shannon Vondy]
So I recommend emailing, you know, as much as you can during a launch time.

00:22:21 [Shannon Vondy]
And the people that are interested, they’ll they’ll be there, and the people that aren’t will just delete or, you know, ignore the emails.
00:22:27 [Shannon Vondy]
So you’re not bugging people.
00:22:28 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re not annoying people.
00:22:29 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re literally just letting them know, like, hey, this is available, and they can buy it when they’re ready.

00:22:34 [Alison]
That makes sense because if, like, you’re having a mini session sale, you’re gonna be emailing them more than your normal once a month email that you would normally send.

00:22:42 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:22:42 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.

00:22:43 [Melissa]
And it’s funny you say that because I’ve I know I learned this at some point last year where I was like, I need to learn this and really take it to heart because I would do like Melissa’s, you know, back to basics SEO, and it was like a five day challenge.
00:22:54 [Melissa]
And I was sending, like, during that challenge, I think I’m only sending one email a day or maybe two emails a day, like, when it was, you know, the first day or whatever, and then I never, like, hyped it up before it.
00:23:05 [Melissa]
And so, like, nobody showed.

00:23:07 [Melissa]
And and I was like, wait a second.
00:23:08 [Melissa]
Nobody knew this was gonna happen.
00:23:10 [Melissa]
So, like, I felt like a failure because I’m like, hey.
00:23:12 [Melissa]
I’m doing this awesome challenge.

00:23:14 [Melissa]
Come join.
00:23:14 [Melissa]
And then, like, a day later, like, people show up and they’re like, hey.
00:23:17 [Melissa]
I didn’t know this was happening.
00:23:18 [Melissa]
Like, what are you talking about?

00:23:20 [Melissa]
And so I was like, okay.
00:23:21 [Melissa]
I need to, like, I need to hyped it up.
00:23:23 [Melissa]
I need to send more emails.
00:23:24 [Melissa]
I need to, you know, do all that kind of stuff.

00:23:26 [Melissa]
So it’s like good to know that, like, yeah.
00:23:29 [Melissa]
When you’re launching something, you’ve got something going on, people need to be reminded more frequently because people forget.
00:23:34 [Melissa]
People are busy.

00:23:36 [Shannon Vondy]
Yes.
00:23:36 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s that’s so good that you said that because that is a huge thing.
00:23:39 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, people forget.
00:23:40 [Shannon Vondy]
And, you know, you you’re thinking about your business all the time and what you’re selling.

00:23:44 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:23:44 [Shannon Vondy]
But they’re not.
00:23:45 [Shannon Vondy]
They have their own business.
00:23:46 [Shannon Vondy]
They have their own lives.
00:23:47 [Shannon Vondy]
And so if you just send one email, they might, like, miss it or they might, like, delete it by accident.

00:23:52 [Shannon Vondy]
So you really do wanna send multiple.
00:23:54 [Shannon Vondy]
And, also, you can send it to different people too.
00:23:57 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, so your warm leads, like, people who have already shown interest, you can send them different emails than your cold leads.

00:24:02 [Shannon Vondy]
You can send, like, a specific email to them.
00:24:04 [Shannon Vondy]
And and you can even get, like, pretty creative with your email launches.
00:24:09 [Shannon Vondy]
So, yeah, I I love that you did that.
00:24:11 [Shannon Vondy]
And I think that’s a a great example because you learned that, like, okay, I need to send more.

00:24:15 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:24:15 [Melissa]
And I think that, like, being in the Blogging Club too and, like, being seeing, like, all the emails you sent to us when you do, like, open up the membership or you were launching, like, the course thing at one point, and, like, just seeing how many emails you were sending and then looking at my own and seeing the comparison, and I was like, oh, okay.

00:24:31 [Melissa]
Like, this makes sense.
00:24:32 [Melissa]
Like, I need to, you know, up it.

00:24:33 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.

00:24:34 [Alison]
And you wanna I’m also thinking, like, thinking about my clients.
00:24:37 [Alison]
Right?
00:24:37 [Alison]
Like, how many of them have come to me and, like, said, oh, I I saw that you had, like, ten days left on your fall sale, and that made me book.
00:24:43 [Alison]
Or, hey, I saw, like, your last day to book fall, and it’s almost sold out.

00:24:46 [Alison]
Right?
00:24:46 [Alison]
So it’s that sort of, like, I guess, urgency, even though you don’t wanna sound salesy, you’re creating urgency and you’re making people remember.
00:24:53 [Alison]
Like, oh, yeah, I’ve been meaning to do that.

00:24:55 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.

00:24:56 [Alison]
Yeah.

00:24:56 [Shannon Vondy]
And and you you’re not there’s nothing wrong with that.
00:24:58 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you’re not being salesy.
00:25:00 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re literally just letting them know.
00:25:01 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you’re helping them.

00:25:02 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:25:02 [Shannon Vondy]
Because if they wanted to book and they missed it, then they’re gonna be sad.
00:25:06 [Shannon Vondy]
So you’re you’re doing them a favor by letting them know, like, hey.
00:25:09 [Shannon Vondy]
You still have time, or this is the last day.

00:25:12 [Shannon Vondy]
So I I definitely think that’s important too.
00:25:15 [Shannon Vondy]
And so, yeah, like, sending those emails is is crucial.

00:25:19 [Melissa]
So when we’re talking about, like, the past clients, like, some photographers may be listening and they’re like, oh, but I’ve already worked with those clients.
00:25:27 [Melissa]
Like, what do I, you know, like, how do I keep touching base with them when, like, you know, they’ve already booked with me?
00:25:32 [Melissa]
Like, why would they need me again?
00:25:34 [Melissa]
So, like, do you have any thoughts on that?

00:25:37 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:25:37 [Shannon Vondy]
So it’s interesting because if you’re, like, a portrait photographer, you might not have a ton of repeat business.
00:25:43 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:25:43 [Shannon Vondy]
But you can still stay in touch with them, and they’re more likely to refer you to a friend.

00:25:48 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:25:48 [Shannon Vondy]
So you’re staying in their mind.
00:25:50 [Shannon Vondy]
And and so when when a friend is like, oh, I need a photographer for this, they’re like, oh, I have the best one.

00:25:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:25:56 [Shannon Vondy]
So they might not, you know, they might not book with you again next year, but they’re gonna refer you.
00:26:01 [Shannon Vondy]
And and that’s valuable.
00:26:03 [Shannon Vondy]
So I would say, like, stay in touch with them.

00:26:05 [Shannon Vondy]
Send them, like, your your regular emails.
00:26:07 [Shannon Vondy]
Share what you’re up to.
00:26:08 [Shannon Vondy]
And, you know, if you’re if you have, like, you know, mini sessions or something, let them know about that.

00:26:14 [Shannon Vondy]
And they might not always be interested, but, like, again, it’s just keeping you top of mind.
00:26:18 [Shannon Vondy]
So I I definitely think it’s valuable to keep emailing your past clients.

00:26:23 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:26:24 [Melissa]
And I think too, like, I see photographers do this, and I’ve actually done this myself when I was in portraiture.
00:26:28 [Melissa]
Like, I send out a Christmas email because it’s it’s November, right, at some point, usually before Thanksgiving, and I’ll do, like, a Christmas or holiday card design that people can do.

00:26:40 [Melissa]
Or, like, we have our, like, holiday minis or something like that.
00:26:42 [Melissa]
And, like, a lot of people wanna get those card photos out the door.
00:26:45 [Melissa]
So, like, you definitely have, like, you can book the same clients more than once in some situations.

00:26:50 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.

00:26:51 [Melissa]
And and I think what people probably forget is they may not book with you again this year, but there could be a couple years down the road that they do.

00:26:58 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:26:58 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.
00:26:59 [Shannon Vondy]
And and, like, that’s what people don’t realize.
00:27:01 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, people are always like, I don’t need them.

00:27:03 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ve already worked with them.
00:27:04 [Shannon Vondy]
But they might need you again.
00:27:05 [Shannon Vondy]
Or, like you said, they’re gonna refer you.
00:27:07 [Shannon Vondy]
So it’s it’s worth staying in touch with them.

00:27:10 [Alison]
And also thinking that, like, as a wedding photographer, like, obviously, like, people only do that once.
00:27:14 [Alison]
But then when you have kids, right, you’re gonna come back.
00:27:17 [Alison]
And when you have your second kid, you’re gonna come back.
00:27:19 [Alison]
When you have your third kid, you’re gonna come back.

00:27:21 [Alison]
So I I love what you said, you know, like, about staying in touch because I’ve had couple of, like, two or three engagements that I’ve photographed, and they’re like, oh, yeah.
00:27:29 [Alison]
We want our first year anniversary photos or our maternity photos or our newborn photos.
00:27:33 [Alison]
And so it all kinda comes full circle to just staying in touch and staying connected.

00:27:37 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.

00:27:38 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:27:38 [Melissa]
I think, like, actually for us, when we had our engagement photos done and our wedding, we never went back to our photographer again because I never heard from her.

00:27:47 [Melissa]
And so I was like, I don’t know if she’s even working anymore.
00:27:50 [Melissa]
Like, I don’t know.

00:27:51 [Shannon Vondy]
Right.

00:27:51 [Melissa]
So, like, I think that just goes to show, like, if you’re not staying in touch with your past clients, they’re gonna forget about you and they’re not gonna refer you because they’re like, I don’t know if she’s still in business.

00:27:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.
00:27:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:28:00 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s such a good point.

00:28:01 [Alison]
I even think about, like, the the the hair person, like, the hairdresser salon, like, if they don’t reach out to me, I’m moving on.

00:28:08 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.

00:28:09 [Alison]
Like, I’m not going back.
00:28:10 [Alison]
Because I I know other people.
00:28:11 [Alison]
I could find them on Instagram.
00:28:12 [Alison]
I could find them in a Facebook group.

00:28:13 [Alison]
So you have to remember, like, staying in touch is just, like, staying relevant, you know, staying, like, out there and in people’s minds.

00:28:20 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:28:20 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s so true.
00:28:21 [Shannon Vondy]
And and, like, I think that’s a really good point too because, like, if you’re not reaching out to people, like, you’re basically, like, you’re losing business.

00:28:27 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:28:28 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you’re losing referrals.
00:28:29 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re losing, you know, potential repeat business.
00:28:32 [Shannon Vondy]
So it’s it’s so important to, like, stay in touch.

00:28:35 [Melissa]
I think too, like, one other thing I wanted to bring up is a lot of photographers might be listening and they’re like, I don’t wanna look like I’m spamming people.
00:28:42 [Melissa]
Like, what do you say to that?

00:28:44 [Shannon Vondy]
So spam is, like, when someone didn’t consent to hearing from you.
00:28:48 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:28:48 [Shannon Vondy]
So if they gave you their email, they consented.

00:28:52 [Shannon Vondy]
And so you’re not spamming them.
00:28:53 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re literally just emailing them about things they should know.
00:28:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:28:57 [Shannon Vondy]
So you’re not spam.

00:28:58 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re not being spammy.
00:28:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you’re literally just emailing them with, like, helpful information or to let them know about your services.
00:29:04 [Shannon Vondy]
So I I think that’s a misconception that a lot of people have is, like, oh, I’m spamming.

00:29:09 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re not.
00:29:10 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re not spamming.
00:29:11 [Shannon Vondy]
You’re emailing your list.

00:29:13 [Melissa]
Mhmm.

00:29:13 [Shannon Vondy]
And and like I said before, if they don’t like it, they can leave.
00:29:16 [Shannon Vondy]
So it’s okay.

00:29:18 [Alison]
And and just, like, thinking, like, from my own personal experience, like, I have on my list people who have never unsubscribed for, like, years.
00:29:25 [Alison]
And so they’re obviously wanting to hear from me even though they’re not booking.

00:29:29 [Shannon Vondy]
Right.

00:29:30 [Alison]
So, like, they’ve not clicked on anything.
00:29:31 [Alison]
They’ve not done anything.
00:29:32 [Alison]
But they’re still there.

00:29:34 [Alison]
So I think it’s just interesting to, like, see that, like, if they wanted off, they would get off.

00:29:38 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.
00:29:39 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:29:39 [Shannon Vondy]
And and so, like, you know, you don’t have to worry so much about, like, oh, am I bothering them?
00:29:43 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you’re not.

00:29:44 [Shannon Vondy]
And if you are, they’ll tell you by unsubscribing.

00:29:47 [Melissa]
So I have a question too.
00:29:49 [Melissa]
Like, when you’re emailing, what should, like, the subject line look like?
00:29:54 [Melissa]
Like, what kind of things should we be putting in our subject lines to get people to open our emails?

00:29:59 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s a great question.
00:30:00 [Shannon Vondy]
So subject lines are are pretty important because that’s the first thing people see.
00:30:03 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:30:04 [Shannon Vondy]
So you wanna make it, like, intriguing or interesting or, you know, something that’s gonna make them wanna open it.

00:30:09 [Shannon Vondy]
So you can do, like, a question.
00:30:12 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, have you thought about this?
00:30:13 [Shannon Vondy]
Or, you know, like, something that’s gonna make them curious.
00:30:16 [Shannon Vondy]
You can also use, like, emojis.

00:30:17 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, that’s a good way to, like, stand out in someone’s inbox.
00:30:21 [Shannon Vondy]
You can also, like, if you’re selling something, you can put, like, the name of what you’re selling.
00:30:25 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, fall mini sessions are here or, you know, like, something like that.

00:30:28 [Shannon Vondy]
But, yeah, you just wanna make it, like, interesting.
00:30:30 [Shannon Vondy]
And and I would say, like, keep it short.
00:30:33 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you don’t wanna write, like, a whole paragraph in your subject line.

00:30:36 [Shannon Vondy]
You wanna keep it, like, pretty short and sweet.

00:30:38 [Melissa]
Okay.
00:30:39 [Melissa]
So one more question.
00:30:40 [Melissa]
Like, what do you think is the biggest mistake photographers make with email marketing?

00:30:45 [Shannon Vondy]
Not sending.

00:30:46 [Melissa]
Just not sending.

00:30:47 [Shannon Vondy]
Just not sending.
00:30:48 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, honestly, the the biggest mistake is just, like, not doing it.
00:30:51 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you you have nothing to lose and so much to gain by just sending an email.

00:30:56 [Shannon Vondy]
So I would say just, like, send.
00:30:58 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, don’t overthink it.
00:30:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Don’t worry about, like, oh, is this perfect?
00:31:01 [Shannon Vondy]
Is this, you know, like, is this good enough?

00:31:03 [Shannon Vondy]
Just send it.
00:31:04 [Shannon Vondy]
And and you’ll learn as you go.
00:31:06 [Shannon Vondy]
But the biggest mistake is not sending at all.

00:31:08 [Melissa]
I love that.

00:31:09 [Alison]
I do too.
00:31:10 [Alison]
Just hit send.

00:31:11 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:31:12 [Shannon Vondy]
Just hit send.

00:31:13 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:31:13 [Melissa]
I think that’s, like, the best advice.
00:31:15 [Melissa]
And and I think, like, even for me, like, I’ve been doing email for, like, a year and a half now consistently, and I still sometimes am like, oh, I don’t know if I should send this or, you know, like, is this good enough?

00:31:24 [Melissa]
But then I just hit send and I’m like, okay.
00:31:26 [Melissa]
It’s done.
00:31:26 [Melissa]
And then people respond and they’re like, oh my god.
00:31:28 [Melissa]
That was so good.

00:31:29 [Melissa]
And I’m like, oh, okay.
00:31:30 [Melissa]
So I was worried for nothing.

00:31:32 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:31:32 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.
00:31:33 [Shannon Vondy]
And and I think that’s the thing is, like, we we build it up in our heads to be this big scary thing.
00:31:37 [Shannon Vondy]
And it’s really not.

00:31:38 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, it’s just an email.
00:31:40 [Shannon Vondy]
And and so I think the more you do it, the easier it gets.
00:31:42 [Shannon Vondy]
But you just have to start.

00:31:44 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:31:44 [Melissa]
I love that.

00:31:45 [Alison]
And I also think too, like, thinking about, like, the the emails that I get from people that I follow, like, I’m not judging them.
00:31:52 [Alison]
Like, I’m not like, oh, that was a terrible email.
00:31:54 [Alison]
Like, I just read it and I’m like, okay.
00:31:56 [Alison]
Cool.

00:31:56 [Alison]
Like, that’s good information or whatever.
00:31:58 [Alison]
So, like, no one’s judging you either.

00:32:00 [Shannon Vondy]
Right.
00:32:01 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:32:01 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s so true.
00:32:02 [Shannon Vondy]
And and I think, like, we forget that, like, people are just, like, reading their emails and, like, going about their day.

00:32:06 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, they’re not, like, dissecting every word.
00:32:08 [Shannon Vondy]
So, yeah, just just send.

00:32:10 [Melissa]
So one last thing I wanted to ask you is, like, what platform do you recommend for photographers who are just getting started with email marketing?

00:32:17 [Shannon Vondy]
So I use Kit, which used to be called ConvertKit.
00:32:20 [Shannon Vondy]
I love it.
00:32:21 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s super user friendly.
00:32:22 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s great for beginners.

00:32:24 [Shannon Vondy]
And it’s also, like, powerful enough for, like, more advanced users too.
00:32:27 [Shannon Vondy]
So I I definitely recommend Kit.
00:32:29 [Shannon Vondy]
But there are other options too, like Mailchimp, Constant Contact, FlowDesk.

00:32:34 [Shannon Vondy]
So, you know, you can kind of explore and see what works best for you.
00:32:37 [Shannon Vondy]
But I personally use Kit and I love it.

00:32:39 [Melissa]
Okay.
00:32:40 [Melissa]
That’s good to know.

00:32:41 [Alison]
And and what about the the promotions tab?
00:32:43 [Alison]
Like, I’ve heard people say, like, oh, I ended up in the promotions tab, so my email didn’t get seen.
00:32:48 [Alison]
What do you say about that?

00:32:50 [Shannon Vondy]
So the promotions tab is, like, a Gmail thing.
00:32:53 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:32:53 [Shannon Vondy]
And so, like, a lot of people think that, like, oh, if I end up in the promotions tab, that means no one’s gonna see my email.

00:32:58 [Shannon Vondy]
But that’s not true.
00:32:59 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, people still check their promotions tab.
00:33:02 [Shannon Vondy]
And and actually, I I check my promotions tab pretty regularly because that’s where, like, all the good stuff is.

00:33:07 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, that’s where, like, the sales are and, you know, like, all that.
00:33:10 [Shannon Vondy]
So I wouldn’t worry too much about that.
00:33:12 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, it’s not the end of the world.

00:33:14 [Shannon Vondy]
And and also, like, there’s not really a way to, like, guarantee that you won’t end up in the promotions tab.
00:33:19 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, it’s just kind of how Gmail categorizes things.
00:33:22 [Shannon Vondy]
So I I wouldn’t stress about it too much.

00:33:25 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:33:26 [Melissa]
I think I’ve heard you say before too that, like, the promotions tab is not the same as spam.

00:33:30 [Shannon Vondy]
Right.
00:33:31 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:33:31 [Shannon Vondy]
Exactly.
00:33:32 [Shannon Vondy]
So, like, spam is, like, a totally different folder.

00:33:35 [Shannon Vondy]
And and so, like, if you’re in the promotions tab, that’s okay.
00:33:38 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, that’s not spam.
00:33:39 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s just, like, where Gmail thinks you should go.

00:33:41 [Shannon Vondy]
So, yeah, don’t don’t worry about it.

00:33:43 [Melissa]
Okay.
00:33:44 [Melissa]
That’s good to know.

00:33:45 [Alison]
So, Shannon, before we wrap up, I just wanted to say, like, this has been so helpful.
00:33:49 [Alison]
And I think, like, you’ve given us so much great information and, like, really actionable stuff that people can go and do right now.

00:33:56 [Alison]
So thank you so much for being here and sharing all of this with us.

00:34:00 [Shannon Vondy]
Of course.
00:34:01 [Shannon Vondy]
Thank you so much for having me.
00:34:02 [Shannon Vondy]
This was so fun.

00:34:03 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:34:04 [Melissa]
And and where can people find you if they wanna, like, learn more about your membership or your services?

00:34:09 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:34:09 [Shannon Vondy]
So I’m on Instagram at missus dot vondy.
00:34:12 [Shannon Vondy]
And then my website is missus vondy dot com.
00:34:15 [Shannon Vondy]
So you can check me out there.

00:34:17 [Shannon Vondy]
And then, like I mentioned earlier, I have a little freebie for you guys, which is, like, a mini email box.
00:34:22 [Shannon Vondy]
So if you wanna grab that, that’ll be in the show notes.

00:34:25 [Melissa]
Awesome.
00:34:26 [Melissa]
Well, thank you so much, Shannon.
00:34:27 [Melissa]
This was great.

00:34:28 [Shannon Vondy]
Thank you.

00:34:29 [Alison]
Thanks, Shannon.

00:34:30 [Melissa]
Bye.

00:34:31 [Shannon Vondy]
Bye.

00:36:01 [Shannon Vondy]
Or I’m

00:36:01 [Alison]
out if I ain’t got no money.
00:36:03 [Alison]
Yeah.
00:36:03 [Alison]
Exact well, you know, I’m

00:36:04 [Shannon Vondy]
like, what you got?
00:36:05 [Shannon Vondy]
So I’m like, I’m I’m going to go buy that stuff.
00:36:07 [Shannon Vondy]
So if your email’s in there, I’m I might even check it out because I’m, like, in my buying mode.
00:36:12 [Shannon Vondy]
You know?

00:36:13 [Alison]
Yeah.
00:36:13 [Alison]
I haven’t heard of that mindset before.

00:36:15 [Shannon Vondy]
But yeah.

00:36:16 [Melissa]
That’s a super good point.
00:36:17 [Melissa]
That promotions tab does not equal spam.
00:36:19 [Melissa]
Spam is a separate folder.
00:36:20 [Melissa]
Trash is obviously a separate folder.
00:36:23 [Melissa]
So if you are ending up in the spam folder or the, you know, trash folder or something like that or junk, I guess, on some of them, then you may actually have a problem and you need to check your stuff.

00:36:31 [Melissa]
But if you’re ending up in promotions, while we may not like it, it may actually be

00:36:36 [Shannon Vondy]
act Yeah.
00:36:36 [Shannon Vondy]
It may be.
00:36:37 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:36:37 [Shannon Vondy]
No.
00:36:38 [Shannon Vondy]
I it’s also just an organizational tool for people.

00:36:40 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?
00:36:40 [Shannon Vondy]
At the end of the day, it’s it’s really not to say like, oh, your stuff is promotions.
00:36:44 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s more just like, oh, I don’t you know, I need the important stuff in my inbox that I, like, you know, my bills are due

00:36:50 [Alison]
or whatever it is.
00:36:51 [Alison]
Right?
00:36:52 [Alison]
Well, awesome.
00:36:52 [Alison]
Well, Shannon, thank you so much.
00:36:54 [Alison]
This has been really insightful.

00:36:56 [Alison]
Lots of little nuggets that were absolutely golden.
00:36:58 [Alison]
So I just have all kinds of ideas rolling out of writing.
00:37:02 [Alison]
So thank you so much for joining us.

00:37:04 [Melissa]
Well and tell us how people can work with you.
00:37:06 [Melissa]
I mean, I know, but I’ll let you explain it.

00:37:08 [Shannon Vondy]
Perfect.
00:37:09 [Shannon Vondy]
Well, I would recommend my membership.
00:37:11 [Shannon Vondy]
We are gonna be reopening doors soon.
00:37:12 [Shannon Vondy]
I don’t know when this is airing, so just check and you’ll you’ll see Yeah.
00:37:16 [Shannon Vondy]
When doors are open.

00:37:17 [Shannon Vondy]
Love to have her.
00:37:18 [Shannon Vondy]
Obviously, Melissa’s been in there for over a year, and I love to just help you make email easy and fun.
00:37:23 [Shannon Vondy]
And there’s tons of templates in there.
00:37:25 [Shannon Vondy]
So again, if you’re just having one of those days that you’re like, I don’t know what to write.
00:37:27 [Shannon Vondy]
Just go pull a template.

00:37:28 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ve done this myself for my own email list.
00:37:30 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s great.
00:37:30 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:37:31 [Shannon Vondy]
I like our templates.
00:37:32 [Shannon Vondy]
Melissa, you tell me.

00:37:32 [Shannon Vondy]
But I like our templates more because it’s like, they tell you what to put in there.
00:37:37 [Shannon Vondy]
They’re not just like, no.
00:37:38 [Shannon Vondy]
I sent six months ago.
00:37:39 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, you go change it to your brand.
00:37:41 [Shannon Vondy]
It’s more like, here’s what you should put in, and we give you examples of, like, if you’re a florist here, write this or whatever.

00:37:47 [Shannon Vondy]
Right?

00:37:47 [Melissa]
Yeah.
00:37:47 [Melissa]
And I will say this, guys.
00:37:49 [Melissa]
When I’m in these emails, I have gotten emails back from people who are like, oh my god.
00:37:53 [Melissa]
That email was so good.

00:37:55 [Alison]
Yay.

00:37:55 [Melissa]
I’ve gotten that and on, several occasions.
00:37:58 [Melissa]
And so, like, I I’m like, okay.
00:38:00 [Melissa]
That’s why I stay.
00:38:01 [Melissa]
I stay in there because I’m like, I know when I get use her email templates and stuff.
00:38:05 [Melissa]
Like, it it seems it definitely makes an impact on people.

00:38:07 [Alison]
Oh my gosh.
00:38:08 [Alison]
That makes me so happy.
00:38:08 [Alison]
I had a client

00:38:09 [Shannon Vondy]
tell me I write her emails.
00:38:10 [Shannon Vondy]
That’s another thing I could do too if you just wanna get it off your plate, my team and I can do it.
00:38:14 [Shannon Vondy]
But I I write my clients’ emails.
00:38:15 [Shannon Vondy]
She told me her own mother said she loves her emails and that they feel like they’re written just to her.
00:38:20 [Shannon Vondy]
And I

00:38:20 [Alison]
was like, your mom, you?

00:38:21 [Shannon Vondy]
But yeah.
00:38:22 [Shannon Vondy]
So, obviously, membership’s great for templates.
00:38:24 [Shannon Vondy]
And then, obviously, we have list growing graphics too that Melissa had mentioned earlier that will help you grow your email list and posting on social and make it easier for you and all that fun stuff.
00:38:32 [Shannon Vondy]
And then I have tons of workshops and courses too.
00:38:34 [Shannon Vondy]
So if you’re just wanting to kinda, like, get started, I have something for that.

00:38:37 [Shannon Vondy]
Or if you’re wanting to just get better at one effective email, I would love

00:38:41 [Alison]
to have you in one of

00:38:41 [Shannon Vondy]
those as well.
00:38:42 [Shannon Vondy]
You have a course too.

00:38:43 [Melissa]
Like the email.
00:38:44 [Melissa]
Yeah.

00:38:44 [Shannon Vondy]
Yeah.
00:38:45 [Shannon Vondy]
So we have plenty of things.
00:38:46 [Shannon Vondy]
Honestly, just come get my DMs, in on Instagram, and

00:38:48 [Alison]
we can if you’re not sure what where

00:38:50 [Shannon Vondy]
to go or what to do, and I’d be happy to guide you and walk you I’m not pressure y.
00:38:53 [Shannon Vondy]
So if it’s, like, not the right fit for you at this time, I get it.
00:38:56 [Shannon Vondy]
Like, I’m not gonna be like Yeah.

00:38:57 [Alison]
How dare I’m not gonna hound you, but

00:38:59 [Shannon Vondy]
I’ll I’d be happy to have a conversation with you.
00:39:01 [Shannon Vondy]
So, yeah, I’m at missus dot bondy on Instagram, and I’d love to just chat with you there.

00:39:06 [Alison]
Awesome.
00:39:06 [Alison]
And we’ll have all those, links in the show notes as well.
00:39:08 [Alison]
So get make it easy.

00:39:10 [Shannon Vondy]
I think I have a little freebie for you guys too for, like, if you don’t know what to say in your emails.
00:39:14 [Shannon Vondy]
I, have a little like, we have an e box.
00:39:16 [Shannon Vondy]
Melissa gets every month in the membership.
00:39:17 [Shannon Vondy]
And so I give you guys a mini one to give to your listeners too.
00:39:20 [Shannon Vondy]
K.

00:39:21 [Shannon Vondy]
So we’ll have

00:39:21 [Alison]
all that, linked up for you.
00:39:22 [Alison]
So super easy.
00:39:23 [Alison]
Make sure you the notes, guys.
00:39:24 [Alison]
And thanks so much, Shannon, for being here.
00:39:26 [Alison]
We appreciate it.

00:39:27 [Melissa]
Thanks for having me.
00:39:30 [Melissa]
Bye bye.
00:39:32 [Melissa]
Thank you so much for listening.
00:39:33 [Melissa]
If you’re enjoying the show, would you do two things for us?
00:39:35 [Melissa]
First, leave a review.

00:39:37 [Melissa]
Just stars would be awesome.
00:39:39 [Melissa]
And two, forward this episode to a biz bestie, mil spouse, spouse, or anyone facing moving their business.
00:39:44 [Melissa]
We’d love it if you shared this episode with even just one person.
00:39:47 [Melissa]
If you have questions, you can reach out to Allison on Instagram at Allison Bell Photog, or you can find me, Melissa, in my Facebook group, Pick Shrinkings.
00:39:56 [Melissa]
Check the show notes for links, and we’re so excited to

00:39:58 [Shannon Vondy]
have you guys here.